NetSquared Organizer Call: How to use Meetup like a PRO

elijah's picture

In this recording of our May 13 Q&A session I show you Meetup tricks that will grow your group —  keyword hacking, sponsor page tweaks, and how to leverage event templates. 

Transcription


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Eli van der Giessen: And so, like, yeah, let's just dive into this quick deck.

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Eli van der Giessen: So here's our title, you know, here's what we'd like grizzled meetup experts need to know

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Eli van der Giessen: So I think one of the key things is meetup works best when you have a plan of upcoming events. If a meetup has no events when someone drifts by checks at your meetup and doesn't see anything upcoming

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Eli van der Giessen: They aren't going to join their group and they're going to keep drifting away. So as much as possible, having three upcoming events is going to be your top growth hack.

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Eli van der Giessen: And obviously you're not always going to know exactly what those next three events are going to be, but even putting into a bit of a dummy event can really help. So say you kind of know the broad theme.

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Eli van der Giessen: But you don't know who your presenter is and all you know really is like, it's probably going to be this date and this theme.

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Eli van der Giessen: Still, put it into meetup because that will be a Great Attractor to new members and as long as at least a week before the event happens

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Eli van der Giessen: You update the details on your meetup, which will then automatically let all the members know about the the new date or the new specific title of the event.

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Eli van der Giessen: That's totally fine. But I would say err on the side of posting more events to meetup, even if you do have to change the details later.

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Eli van der Giessen: The other part of this is to be visual in your event descriptions and I'll show you how to do that.

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Eli van der Giessen: And that's really important because whenever someone shares these through social media channels.

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Eli van der Giessen: These images are going to automatically be included within the post and it's going to make things just seem a lot more vibrant

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Eli van der Giessen: A lot of the pre prepared graphics will actually be found in the organizers guide. So each one of like our 20 suggested topics.

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Eli van der Giessen: Also includes a generic graphic like this as well that you can use. But of course, don't be restricted to this and you know if you've got another great illustrating

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Eli van der Giessen: Image, go for it. Or, you know, find a great image over at something like unflashy calm, which is, you know, a great source for free stock photography

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Robert Schafbuch: See Eli No, don't interrupt, but, um, so I think that's really good to know. I'm not a graphic design guy and I think that's a great idea to be kind of, let's just say

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Robert Schafbuch: sparkly and marketing. You know when you're putting this together. So can we use some of the images and visuals from text soup. We just kind of get your I guess approval on that before we post

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Eli van der Giessen: If you find a great image on Texas website like

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Eli van der Giessen: Absolutely. Go for it. The only restriction around that is there are some restrictions around the use of the Texas logo itself.

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Eli van der Giessen: Actually show drop into the chat window, some of the some of the guidance around that. But basically, feel free to use the net square logo, wherever you are, if you find a great image on tech soup run with it totally copy and paste it out.

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Eli van der Giessen: But, uh, but if you are sort of seeing if it's got like the Texas logo in it.

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Eli van der Giessen: And it hasn't been basically provided by us ahead of time. Be cautious without saying, you know, and maybe check with me, just in case.

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Eli van der Giessen: But yeah, as as a non designer as well. This is why I sort of got some basically a template from some of the

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Eli van der Giessen: Designers within tech safe and they said, like here to spell this out. And so I've also got these templates in Canada. And so usually all you need to do is

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Eli van der Giessen: Drop a logo, like an image on one side, update the text on the other side. So it just really kind of locked down to make it easy for a non designer, like myself, or maybe you to tweak it for each new topic as it emerges.

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Eli van der Giessen: The other thing about meetup is you need to be really communicative like let people know about your plans and your events. And there's two primary ways to do them.

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Eli van der Giessen: Within your meetup itself, there's a way to message all the members or you can filter down all kinds of ways like went to the last two events, but not the previous event or

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Eli van der Giessen: You know, or haven't you know opened up any of my emails recently. So you can do all kinds of filters there by default is just going to message all your members, and that's your primary communications method.

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Eli van der Giessen: Here in the left, you'll see that there's also a discussions area. And there's a discussion Jerry at two levels. There's one at the whole group level on your homepage.

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Eli van der Giessen: And then there's another one at each like event level. And so the top level one obviously is for things that are of interest to the group more widely and it's a great place for you to just like

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Eli van der Giessen: Drop basically an SMS style like quick update like maybe you've got a partner who has their own event. You want to promote

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Eli van der Giessen: Or maybe there's some other interesting resource, you can just drop it in here and it's a quick way just to get into the inbox. If your members.

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Eli van der Giessen: And then at the event level that discussions tab is a great way for you to share resources that the presenter maybe shares ahead of time or a blog post on the theme.

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Eli van der Giessen: Or maybe a link to the slides from the event afterwards you get this sort of use it as, again, just a quick way because what you'll see is meetup is not super flexible. It's not a full marketing tool, but it's really simple and has good defaults.

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Eli van der Giessen: And speaking of those default. Yeah, go ahead. Robert

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Robert Schafbuch: Yeah, as the donor up too much here, but, um, you know, Eli. As I'm looking at your content. One of the things that just candidly comes to mind is, um, you know, maybe sick, you know, there's security comes to mind. You know, we've been hearing a lot about some of the zoom bombing and inappropriate.

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Robert Schafbuch: Members, you know, members joining meetings, what's your experience as a meetup administrator on needing to remove members from a group that may be spammy or

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Robert Schafbuch: Do want to think negatively here. But what's your experience.

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Eli van der Giessen: Yeah, so I think it's a great question. In fact, just this morning I

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Eli van der Giessen: Removed two members of my own group in Vancouver, because they weren't real members, they were just there to drop spam in that comment area.

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Eli van der Giessen: And so the first thing I've done is actually you can set up that comment area.

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Eli van der Giessen: To basically allow only you to post as opposed to any members to post. And actually, I would recommend that you restrict it to just you, because there has been a bit of a problem over the last day six months of Meetup.

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Eli van der Giessen: Where people have been abusing that feature. So they'll post an event.

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Eli van der Giessen: It gets messaged all your members are sorry, like a piece of spam and then basically their account is instantly deleted but by that point the emails already gone out so so that's sort of actually been sort of under control from the meetup side of things.

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Eli van der Giessen: Otherwise, on the zoom bombing side of things. We have had one incident within our community, you know, last month, so it is something that I've been working on to sort of

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Eli van der Giessen: Tighten up the restrictions and the primary way I've been doing that with these zoom rooms have been opening up is I am now always joining for the basically 15 minutes before the event starts

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Eli van der Giessen: To make sure that I actually give you the full administrator powers which means you can sort of kick anyone else out of the room.

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Eli van der Giessen: No one else can take over screen sharing from the event host. And we sort of have locked it down a little bit that way because I think it's, yeah, it's important for us to

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Eli van der Giessen: Be aware of that and we moved to quickly as Kobe hit and we all said like we just need like a quick like zoom solution, but we did lock it down quite enough at the beginning.

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Eli van der Giessen: So, so I think going back to that idea of like how is meetup useful for you. And I think the main thing meetup does is once you post your event.

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Eli van der Giessen: You're basically done so it's going to do some automatic reminders to all your members, you don't have to do a thing around that that's going to happen, six days before the event. And then one day before the event.

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Eli van der Giessen: And so that's just automatic as a meetup feature I can't change that schedule. It's sort of hard baked in. But it's quite helpful and it's based on, you know, there are many millions of members about when people are more likely to respond to a reminder. So that's super helpful.

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Eli van der Giessen: The other thing you'll want to do, of course, is go in as once you're a meetup administrator and review your settings.

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Eli van der Giessen: And there's some pretty important settings in there that I think can can really help your group grow.

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Eli van der Giessen: One of those. Just make sure that you've got a really clear description. I'm going to put in a standard piece of boilerplate when I create your brand new Meetup.

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Eli van der Giessen: But it's not going to necessarily be about your group, it's not going to talk about maybe your local partners or the style of events, you want to do.

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Eli van der Giessen: And so you can drop your own text in there like you'll see in my group I've created a bit of a sponsorship page for Vancouver so

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Eli van der Giessen: I'd say like, you know, come here, like, go to our sponsorship page. And we also in our group have our own website. So in this case will be also linked back into that resource where we keep blog posts and podcasts from our events. So as an administrator, you can go in and tweak that text.

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Eli van der Giessen: The other thing, and maybe the most important thing is the way meetup does its promotion is it has these sets of 20 topics. So when a meetup is created. It basically says, like, select some topics or keywords that we can use to match new meetup members to your group.

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Eli van der Giessen: And and some of these, you know, the, basically, they're all here within the system. And you can tweak them at any time and update them.

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Eli van der Giessen: And so, you know, I've got usually a bit of a selection of some ways around like nonprofit things around technology things

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Eli van der Giessen: But I'd recommend you go in like every six months tweak these to see if you can track other people because what happens is when a person creates a brand new meetup profile.

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Eli van der Giessen: meetup also ask that person to basically select for themselves like 20 topics that they care about. And then they use those topics to do a bit of a matching

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Eli van der Giessen: So I avoid putting in topics that only have like the big Net Squared right here I put it in here because it's useful for me from a search standpoint.

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Eli van der Giessen: But you'll see there's only 130 meetup groups using it worldwide, which means not that many people actually have that in their own profile. So this Netscape. It's not really useful.

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Eli van der Giessen: As a matching term. Whereas if you put something in like professional networking or internet professionals, which has, like, you know,

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Eli van der Giessen: 5000 other groups, you know, there's a lot of people putting that into their own profiles as well. And so you'll want to just sort of tweak your

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Eli van der Giessen: topics to be both specific enough to be accurate about your group, but also, you know, wide enough that you're going to cast a big net to find people

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Eli van der Giessen: The other thing you can do, of course, is put him sponsors to recognize your partners locally. So your venue partner.

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Eli van der Giessen: Anyone who may be is contributing either their time or their expertise, you can go in and add them as sponsors I automatically put in tech soup. And that's where it here.

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Eli van der Giessen: But you can also put in other partners. So you'll see LIKE I'VE GOT THE HIVE WHICH IS MY Vancouver co working venue partner. But the thing that I stole from oh gosh, I don't even remember who it was, again,

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Eli van der Giessen: I think it might have been Los Angeles, years ago, is this idea of using that sponsorship say section to basically

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Eli van der Giessen: Advertised for sponsors in your own group. So you'll see right here. I've just got this generic one like your name here and then I'm like,

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Eli van der Giessen: You'll get access to our 3000 members talk to us about sponsorship and then you click and it will go to the sponsorship page that we created for our group. So that's a great way to for us to use that sponsors that page to sort of recruit and attract potential new sponsors.

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Eli van der Giessen: And then the other thing which is sorely underused in meetup is these templates. So as I've talked about I've sort of got like these 20 event recipes. We've created with like preset topics and descriptions

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Eli van der Giessen: But actually, the other way to access some of those is when you go and create a new group. There's actually a button here that says like start from a template.

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Eli van der Giessen: And what you can do is I just say select. Oh, from a drop down button. I want to do something about like community isn't cancelled, you select it and automatically fills in

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Eli van der Giessen: The zoom link your event description, the topic. So all that's just like boom, boom, boom. It's in there. So all you really need to do then is select the right time and then for start promoting your event.

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Eli van der Giessen: What other tip I have is to avoid reoccurring events.

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Eli van der Giessen: They tend to get less uptake within Meetup. They seem to like not promote them as hard within the platform as well as we find that having a unique title for every event.

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Eli van der Giessen: It makes it much easier for people to get excited and RSVP for your event. Whereas if it looked like, oh, it's like July meetup July, be like, you know, it's, it doesn't look as welcoming. So I would say try and avoid reoccurring events as much as possible.

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Eli van der Giessen: So that's sort of my quick tip sheet here.

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Eli van der Giessen: You know, and I actually, I've got one more tip that I really wanted to share, which is a thing that the sentence can be forgotten.

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Eli van der Giessen: me just move this over here. So, so if you go into meetup and you create an event.

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Eli van der Giessen: Here it is. The kids upcoming event, but you'll see there's this little bar at the top here which says this, like you haven't announced this event yet.

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Eli van der Giessen: And so it's important. Once you're ready with your event and you've got all the details set is to click that announcement.

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Eli van der Giessen: Because once you do that, that begins that marketing promotion push and I sometimes see that a group

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Eli van der Giessen: forgets to hit that announced button and therefore they never actually get that marketing emails out through meetup so

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Eli van der Giessen: So basically this is the okay I've been tweaking my event up and down for the next last couple of months because as I said like, it's good to get even a partial event in sooner than later.

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Eli van der Giessen: But once you you're ready with all your details, you know, and say it's three weeks out

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Eli van der Giessen: Click that button start the marketing promotion. It'll get that first email out and then schedule those other reminder emails six days and 24 hours out before the event.

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Eli van der Giessen: So that's I think some of the key pieces I want to review, we can use my group here in Vancouver, just like review some of what that actually looks like so.

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Eli van der Giessen: So, you know, here's what it looks like when you come into meetup and and as I talked about you know what it shows you is the upcoming events, the members. And then here at the bottom there is this discussions area.

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Eli van der Giessen: And so you'll see, you know, I put like my last post here was in February, saying like, Hey, here's our most recent podcast. So I wanted to make sure that people knew about that because we record the audio of all of our events.

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Eli van der Giessen: If you want to go in and start tweaking those settings. What you do is you go into the Manage group area.

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Eli van der Giessen: And then from here. Go to Edit group settings.

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Eli van der Giessen: And that's what you're going to find all those settings. I was talking about. So under here under basic if we click in there. This is where you can see both the group name, which you can edit, as well as all the description text.

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Eli van der Giessen: Make sure that you have your most important text basically in those top two pages. That's what's going to show be by default on your page before someone joins your group.

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Eli van der Giessen: And then they need to click into see the rest of the content, but it's important just to get all this here. I've also put in things like our Community Code of Conduct, just to make sure people have a good sense of like if there's an issue. How do we respond to it.

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Eli van der Giessen: And then the other one. I think that's really important is this topics area.

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Eli van der Giessen: And so you can go in here and treat your topic. So you're saying like

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Eli van der Giessen: Maybe this isn't really about database professionals. Maybe that's a little bit too focused, maybe I want to put something in about networking. So you just go in here.

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Eli van der Giessen: You type and you'll see it starts doing some auto completion and I'm like, oh, professional networking. Yes, that's what we're all about. So I'm going to click into that and it sort of updated that as a topic, and then you just go in here.

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Eli van der Giessen: And

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Eli van der Giessen: Click Submit and it's updated that topic for you.

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Eli van der Giessen: Similarly, if you scroll down here, you'll see there's the optional features.

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Eli van der Giessen: And that's where you can do things like turn on the mailing list or the message board.

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Eli van der Giessen: I've kept them off at the moment, mostly because they've been pretty spammy over time, but it's also a great place for you to put your social links. So if you've created a Facebook group.

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Eli van der Giessen: Or have a Twitter handle for your group which is not required, but always a nice idea, then you can drop those links in here as well. So people can find you.

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Eli van der Giessen: And then you'll see in this last section. They've got the sponsors area and you can

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Eli van der Giessen: Add sponsors here and when you add a sponsor. It also says like, do you want to email all your members with a quick blurb about the sponsor. So you can be. That's part of the ways you can support.

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Eli van der Giessen: Your sponsors to say like, Oh yeah, like, you know, off of this venue. We're going to tell her 200 members all about how great you are give me two paragraphs and I'll make sure that gets out there.

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Eli van der Giessen: So that's sort of the back end settings. There's a couple other options, but most of its I think not too important for us.

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Eli van der Giessen: I think the core experience, of course, is the going in and clicking that big red button because we want to create an event. And so all you do is you go in here. Click Create a new event.

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Eli van der Giessen: And as you create a new event. It needs a couple pieces of required information, but very little bits fully required like the title is always required

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Eli van der Giessen: You know, time and date you can fill that in. You can throw your photo in here. And when you upload a photo. If it's not this specific resolution, it'll actually allow you to crop that image so you don't need to worry too much about it being the specific perfect size.

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Eli van der Giessen: And then you can put your event description in here, you'll see it's not required. So if you don't have that description yet.

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Eli van der Giessen: You can make that happen a little bit later. And then you'll see the newest feature to meetup, which is this big checkbox make this

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Eli van der Giessen: An online event right now it's turned on by default. Because meetup is discouraging live events. They really want everything to be in person and then you put your actual zoom link right in here.

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Eli van der Giessen: And that's the core of it, you'll see there's a couple optional settings here where you can ask members a question you can allow people to bring guests.

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Eli van der Giessen: You can, you know, then also has this registration form, which by default has first and last name, but you can also ask for people's role their organization. The main reason for their attending. So you can start getting a little bit more information about your attendees.

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Eli van der Giessen: But here's the piece which is sort of just shortcut, which is you can just click on the right here, start from a template.

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Eli van der Giessen: And then I've got four events template it in right here. So you'd say, like, here's the newest event one you'll see our last update updated it on April 10 I click Select and boom, it drops the title in here.

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Eli van der Giessen: It puts in the standard event description and it drops in even the zoom link. So all that just goes, bang. You're done for all you really have to do is just like, oh, I want it to be say July 9 and you set a time and then boom, you go down to the very bottom.

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Eli van der Giessen: I can't see because I've got all these other zoom buttons in here, but there is the publish button there and off you go. And that's the core

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Eli van der Giessen: things you need to know about meetup for those who are spending more time in a mobile phone. There's also an app on both

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Eli van der Giessen: IOS and Android. That will give you much of the same experience around creating the event. It doesn't give you all the options around like setting those keywords, you'll need to do that on a desktop, but to just create an event, you can do all of that through a mobile experience as well.

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Eli van der Giessen: So that's the key pieces about Meetup. What I would say is, once you've created your event.

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Eli van der Giessen: What you'll want to do is tell people about it so meetup will do those two promotions. The six days and the 48 hours or 24 hours out. But, uh, I think you should tell people more often.

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Eli van der Giessen: You know, I give them, give them an update, say like, Oh, here's like, you know, a tip from the, the host or the expert who says like, you know, you should really read this blog post ahead of showing up for the event like you know

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Eli van der Giessen: Throw a teeny bit of like one short little piece of content or Keizer in but from the organizer tools. Once you created an event. You can go in and

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Eli van der Giessen: Contact your attendees. And so if there's maybe some homework, they need to do, or a survey, they need to do ahead of time, you can do that all from right here and from here you can either message everyone across your whole community about this one event.

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Eli van der Giessen: Or you can only message it to people who stay up RSVP yes for the event. So if you have like a follow up for attendees.

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Eli van der Giessen: This is a great place to drop that in. And, you know, this is all pretty standard like subject message.

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Eli van der Giessen: And that's a nice way to message people, but there is one hacked, because obviously relaying an email that you already have somewhere can be a bit of a pain.

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Eli van der Giessen: But you'll see at the bottom here, they actually have a way for you to message all your members from your own email client. So if you had a great email that you got from someone and you just wanted to forward that all of your meetup members, you would use this address down here.

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Eli van der Giessen: And as long as you're sending it from the same email address. That is also the email address. It used to be a meetup account.

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Eli van der Giessen: This will actually send it out to all the members be cautious about this because it's not filtered

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Eli van der Giessen: Which means it's going always to all Members, you can't send it to just like the people who have RSVP for a certain percentage of your events.

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Eli van der Giessen: But it's a great way for you to say like, Oh, I've got actually a perfect email from someone that I want to share with all my partners, instead of maps are all my

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Eli van der Giessen: Members, instead of having to go and recreate that here you can just forward it directly from your own email client. So that one's i think i some that tips I want to share them. Anyone else have any questions that have emerged as I've gone through meet up here.

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Robert Schafbuch: Well, you know, based on your experience of running meetups i mean i'm depending on your target audience may sway this question, but um

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Robert Schafbuch: For Meetup. I guess attendees. Do you see running those during the day during the weekday weeknights mean, what's your experience on kind of optimizing and getting most traction on people attending

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Eli van der Giessen: So, so I think most of our experience has been around live events. And I would say the vast majority about 75% of the groups are doing their events in the evening. Usually they're doing something like a six to 7:30pm on a Tuesday, Wednesday or Thursday. So they try to avoid like you know

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Eli van der Giessen: Like the beginning of the end of the week if only because also often holiday days. And so it allows you to keep a consistent schedule because that's actually one of the

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Eli van der Giessen: Not meetup platform specific tips, but having a really recurring regular schedule.

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Eli van der Giessen: Is both easier for you because you get to know exactly what your life is going to look like, but also

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Eli van der Giessen: It's really helpful for the members to have a good sense. So if you say like, Oh, we're always going to be on the second Wednesday of every month. That gives you something to build towards gives you sort of a regular rhythm to work towards

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Eli van der Giessen: There is a couple other groups have picked. Other times, there's a couple groups that do sort of lunch and learn

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Eli van der Giessen: Times, and there's some groups. Most they find in Africa who have embraced the weekend sort of more three hour workshop format. And often that's simply because

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Eli van der Giessen: Of like travel times make it a little bit harder, but I would say for live events. The biggest thing that selects when we host our meetings. And the reason they're typically in the evening is simply because that's when the free venues tend to be available. If you're using someone's boardroom.

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Eli van der Giessen: So, so basically that practicality has chosen the time we've done the events.

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Eli van der Giessen: As we're moving into these online spaces. It's too soon for us to get a good sense of

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Eli van der Giessen: What that looks like. But what I'm quickly saying is evening events are less popular in the for online events. And in fact, when I surveyed my own group here in Vancouver.

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Eli van der Giessen: Actually a 930 morning event was the most popular event time. I think part of it is just people feel less burnt out by being on zoom all day.

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Eli van der Giessen: With these morning events, but by the end of the day, the idea of being tied to the computer for another hour. It sounds like punishment. So I think earlier seems to be working better for online events.

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Jaideep: Automated reminder

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Eli van der Giessen: Yeah.

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Jaideep: These automated reminders can be customized

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Eli van der Giessen: Good questions. I did. So the answer is no, the automated reminders cannot be customized. It's totally locked down both the timing and the content.

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Eli van der Giessen: And what it really does it just sends essentially that the whole description, like here is the the title. Here's the image.

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Eli van der Giessen: Here's the text description and then it includes sort of at the top, of course, the time and the links. So those automated reminders happen.

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Eli van der Giessen: Just filling them without asking them to change the text or the timing, which is why I think it's actually often really quite helpful to go into those organizer tools.

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Eli van der Giessen: And click contact attendees to send them additional messaging where you actually get to tweak the experience a little bit more

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Eli van der Giessen: It's really helpful as well because honestly at some point if someone's a member of several meetups they start to tune out those automatic reminders.

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Eli van der Giessen: So going in with a a message to the members that looks a little bit different is formatted a little bit different can actually be quite helpful.

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Jaideep: And when can I start using Meetup.

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Eli van der Giessen: So the answer is sooner than later. So, so what happens with meetup is when a new group leader comes in. What I ask is for you to basically outline your first two to three events.

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Eli van der Giessen: And that's useful because as I talked about nobody joins a meetup when there's no upcoming events, but it's especially helpful with a brand new Meetup. Because what happens when you create a meetup.

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Eli van der Giessen: Is about three days after the meetup is created meetup com will send to all of its members are with that keyword matching I talked about

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Eli van der Giessen: A message saying, hey, here's a great new event. And if you've got them. Here's your upcoming event. So it's your very best marketing opportunity.

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Eli van der Giessen: Within meetup because it's your one time to get like that that big blast out to the wider meetup membership.

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Eli van der Giessen: And therefore I really want you to have several upcoming events scheduled because

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Eli van der Giessen: That you are going to make the best use of that email marketing moment. So basically, the moment you're able to send me the outline of your first two to three events which is, you know, basically the title, the time

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Eli van der Giessen: And I, you know, and obviously, at this point, we're all going to do it online. Well, then I'll be able to create your meetup com group and the process is for me because I'm the one who pays to the meetup all create the meetup initially for you using sort of our standard boilerplate text.

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Eli van der Giessen: And then I'll send you the link to that video, you'll join the meetup and then from there, I will make you the CO administrator

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Eli van der Giessen: So basically, that's the process which is you send me the outlines I create the meetup. I give you the keys to manage that data.

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Eli van der Giessen: And then I really step away and going forward. You'll do all the messaging to your members, you'll post all upcoming events.

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Eli van der Giessen: And I'll be chasing up behind you, because I'll see in my email inbox every time you announced one of your events. But honestly, you get to decide those topics, the timing and there isn't usually any preclearance by me required. Does that help JD

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Jaideep: Yeah, absolutely.

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Eli van der Giessen: No worries.

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Eli van der Giessen: Well, they don't need to keep you here all day. You know, I think I was hoping to aim for about 45 minutes. So we've got about three minutes left. Maybe time for

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Eli van der Giessen: Two more questions if anyone has anything pressing. Otherwise, of course, know that

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Eli van der Giessen: All upload this recording, by the end of the day, and share this out with you. So if there's a part, you missed or if you lost your connection for a little while. This will be available for you to circle back to as well.

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Eli van der Giessen: And listen things dropped into the chat. So the questions are good, perfect it. So yeah, I think I answered your question there. And then, yeah, a manual question was, is there going to be a recording of it. And the answer is yes. Both the slides, although they're pretty

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Eli van der Giessen: Not useful by themselves are pretty high level. But yeah, the full recording and the slides will be available later today.

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Eli van der Giessen: Yeah. And of course, if you have any other questions that would prefer to chat, maybe because you don't have audio connection for sure. You can drop them in as well.

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Eli van der Giessen: Well, excellent. If they're doesn't give me any other questions, let's bring this to an end. So you can move on to the rest of your day.

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Eli van der Giessen: We've got people from all kinds of time zones, you know, across Asia, Africa, the US. So some of you are joining me like earlier on in the morning and late, late at night and I appreciate your flexibility.

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Robert Schafbuch: I see you have a good day.

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Eli van der Giessen: For all the best Sia.

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Eli van der Giessen: Awesome get shutting it all down. Thank you so much for joining us today. And as I say, the recording will come to you soon.